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Wish List Ecotron camping - The problem/improvements

Discussion in 'Technical - Suggestions and Bug Reports' started by Hatten, Dec 19, 2016.

  1. Hatten
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    Hatten Member
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    Hey!

    So I went down to the HUB and the faction terminal to see if there were any UL-ecotrons there, ofc there wasnt but I've reached the conclusion that the system is flawed.

    • Is the current camping system fair? - Nah not really as it doesnt really reward loyal cyrene players as long as you have 200 badges
    • Does the current system tempt players to use macros/autoclickers? - Yes as the drops are very sporadic its tempting to use a macro to make sure that if a drop comes you'll be the one getting it. (I suspect that people already are doing this, not pointing any fingers but it seems like it)
    • Does the current system promote cyrene as a bot-free, active planet? - No not at all, campers create no revenue for the PP whilst standing there and cyrene being seen as a place where you camp for UL-weapons isn't great for anyone.
    • Could this system be improved in order to fix these problems? Ofc they could, and the PP would benefit as well.

    There are probably many different solutions but I will present mine, in the hope that something will be done to fix this.

    My idea is basically a queue system that rewards cyrene based players.

    • First up, create a token that you recieve upon reaching the 200 badge level. You could get one for armor and one for weapons.
    • Secondly, add another terminal or npc that you hand the token to in order to enter the queue for the item that you want (that is out of stock). The npc/terminal could tell you your position in the queue or not, I dont really care.
    • If you decide to leave cyrene, you will forfeit your position in the queue and upon return you'll get the token back.
    • In my opinion you should only be able to use the token once per arc faction lvl, but this isn't that important if you have a functioning queue.
    What are the perks?
    • The UL-stuff that everyone wants will be more evenly distributed
    • No bots
    • More active players on cyrene
    • Better retention rate
    This is my suggestion but I really hope that something is done, the camping isn't the way to go imho.

    Merry christmas to all of you!

    Hatten
    Justine likes this.
  2. Noorie
    • Cyrene Pioneer

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    It could be more simple:

    Make that UL weapon Non tradable and everyone to obtain it once in a lifetime per arc faction level.
    The above proposed token queue system would be good for armor pieces only.
  3. Hatten
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    I agree but MA has stated in the past that if there isnt a bug with the item they won't change them. So it seems unlikely that they would be make untradeable, but fixing the distribution is still possible.
  4. Noorie
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    It really became over crowded down there.
    Perhaps should put some side games like belot, poker, slots etc the throng can play while waiting :boxer:
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2016
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  5. Yondu
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    Yondu New Member
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    I think this would be the best way to solve this problem in my opinion and a dependency on certain loot items (like the bones ) to gain the badges in the first place should help the economy ?
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  6. Hatten
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    As I mentioned earlier, this is an unlikely scenario as MA is reluctant to change item properties unless there is some sort of bug or abuse associated with the item. I wish that they could make them ava bound but im afraid its too late for that now.
  7. Justine
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    I agree with that, best way is to change shrapnel by bone or a useless item looted like big wing bird or intact eye, etc...
    That will help Cyrene economy and more hard for camper to get these items
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016
  8. San
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    Tradeability of or at least the possibility to auction certain items has been revoked on several occasions when the effect on the community has turned out too corrosive. But I don't recall this to be the case for something which wasn't out in large amounts.

    How long have we been waiting for this vendor to be stocked, and how many have been made available so far? One? Two? Somehow I doubt it will move them. They control supply at the source and from the beginning. The camping and subsequent racketeering causes outrage in the community, but this doesn't appear to be seen as harmful by the authority.

    There has been a clear policy of stamping out any sources of unlimited supply of unlimited items. None are available from any planet's TT anymore. Crafted unlimited items are outmoded and unattractive, the blueprints' only use remains skilling. And here we have a setup which brings such a source back. After achieving your entitlement to access the vendor, you could theoretically take out as many copies as you want. I believe that this might be the root of the problem.

    We don't know if MA communicates to the PP what the exact problem is, or if they just say yes or no to something the PP creates. Or if they let them do and only stop them when it goes too far out, which can cause difficult situations for a PP. Now they are forced to deal with a disappointed sense of entitlement among the players. Whether or not it could have been foreseen, repetition has to be avoided.

    There is a faction of EU players staunchly opposed to any avatar-bound items, because they hate the idea of not being able to make their 'investment' back. Or not being able to just buy whatever they want without doing any other work for it. I say to hell with it, in a game there must be a sense of achievement other than sheer wallet power. The achievement is worthless if flaunting it does not come with the knowledge of the observer that you actually went through the motions for it.

    Another problem could be that MA finds the price for these unlimited items too cheap. Again we don't know if they said anything to that tune. But if this is the case, I suggest allowing shrapnel payment only for limited items. Unlimited items are to be paid in mission tokens, or in this case perhaps with the badges directly which are already not tradable with other players. Based on this, the situation could be re-evaluated if revoking the tradeability of the gun is desirable or not.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016
  9. krasko
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    This approach is too radical.

    Give one ul weapon per player leave it tradeable.
    I like the token idea.
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  10. penethol
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    Krask'ho!
  11. Hatten
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    The only weapon that has gone from tradeable to bound afaik is Bukins blade, my guess is that this was due to the unlimited supply that tempted ppl to create alts to farm blades and resell. The situation on cyrene isn't the same, the supply is very limited and there is nothing to indicate that the supply will improve because changing the status from tradeable to bound.

    Even if they changed the payment from sharp to misc useless cyrene loot this wouldnt really make any difference unless the cost would be almost the same as the value. The camping would still be a problem.

    As far as my suggestion goes it doesnt really distinguish between tradeable/bound. I think people still would camp for them even if they are bound.

    My concern is really the camping. My guess is that the supply won't change but we need a better system to handle the supply. Just standing there waiting for a rifle isn't good for anyone, thats my main point.
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  12. Justine
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    Let tradable the weapon, and change shrapnel, for me its best way. You can put ARC Tokens on Epic zeladoth, Epic Jellyworm and The Duke, that will help the funny wave event :)
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  13. jetsina
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    I get the continued impression that anything requiring the input of MA requires a dumbing down into the smallest of manageable steps to even stand a chance of implementation. Thus 5x2 has to be split into 2+2+2+2. ( <--- yeah, I know! - but this is like asking what the dates need to be for a nine day event, or is it a ten day event??? - see nearby planet for that ongoing (undiscovered?) joke!)

    That said, I like the idea of a queue that requires being on the planet - and in THEORY a queuing system is around in inactive platform code for the space transport mission system. But if the drop rate is set at 6 months or whatever, then that's not going to be practical anyway.
  14. Noorie
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    Well, in this case ppl will start to create alts since it isn't so expensive to obtain the required amount of badges for the vendor access.

    As Justine said, removing the shrapnel for the ul weapon would be a good step.

    The gun is rare and should be purchased using something more rare than shrapnel.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016
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  15. krasko
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    I doubt you can obtain 200 badges that easy with a brand new avatar.
    Imagine that 94 hp dude killing Devastator Sea Wraiths. :eek:
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  16. Hec
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    A problem with queuing up via tokens; if a player takes a break then everyone after them gets to wait, and wait... Unbound is perfectly fine, as others mentioned there's limited supply and this is RCE afterall.

    BUT the OP brings up a really excellent point about rewarding loyal Cyrene citizens.
    So how about the Dev's come up with a simple compromise? For example:

    1. Keep the current system/guns in place.

    2. Add another NPC that gives the same identical UL Guns and Armor in the same manner except:
    - These items are user bound.
    - Players can only get 1 of each item. (simply use mission system just to track each part received?)
    - Items can be exchanged to NPC for exchange token (remaining) TT value.
    (sort of like Ark's viceroy armor returns, But Cyrene's exchange token would be used with misc. cyrene loots to try to get higher tiers.)

    Maybe add something to the names of the (user bound) items like * or (S) or -Bound etc.???
    Also consider making these user bound items color/texture customizable?
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  17. Noorie
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    it will take around one and half month for a new toon to get there by completing most of low level arc badge missions and all dailies except the devastator sea wraith.:shoot:
  18. Hatten
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    The problem here is that the camping will be a problem. If the supply of bound items is unlimited, ie if everyone that has 200 badges would recieve a bound UL-item it would most likely influence the price of all other weapons. It would be too cheap to get it. Therefore the supply would most likely never be unlimited and camping would still be needed. In this case they would have to increase the cost of obtaining it.

    The queue system could have conditions attached to it, ie you need to visist the npc/terminal or hand something in every week or so and you'd have to come online atleast like 72h after you've been rewarded with a rifle in order to claim it.

    The way I see it there are a few basic conditions that we have to accept (with MA being the way they are)
    • Supply will always limited if the current cost stays the same or below the current market value of similar items
    • They are unlikely to change the attributes of existing weapons unless there is an exploit/abuse in relation to the item
  19. krasko
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    You may not see it, but current logic is supportive for loyal Cyrene players.
    You stay on the planet you have better chances to obtain the weapon.

    From what I see all the avatars that looted ecotrons so far are hardcore cyrene players spending their time mostly on this planet.
    Haruto Rat and Hatten like this.
  20. Hatten
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    That is probably true, but you arent really participating in the economy when camping for a weapon. I'd rather be hunting/mining/crafting and contributing to the PP than standing down here in the HUB waiting for something that might never happen.

    Wouldnt it be better if we had a system that encouraged both loyalty and activity? It seems like that would atleast be better for the planet partner.
    krasko likes this.

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